The Wize Way

Episode 178: Your Time Costs More Than Any Client Will Ever Pay

• Wize Mentoring for Accountants and Bookkeepers

Share episode

 Most firm owners don’t realise they’re the most expensive employee in their own business.
They jump into client work thinking they’re helping — but every time they do, the firm’s most valuable time is spent on the least leveraged task.

In this episode, Ed Chan breaks down why firm owners should never be billable. He explains how doing client work turns your time into the most expensive cost in the business — and why your real value lies in coaching the team, not doing the work.

You’ll learn:
✅ Why the owner’s time is the most expensive line item in the firm
✅ How doing billable work kills profit and scalability
✅ What a “deep and narrow” team structure looks like (and why it works)
✅ How to shift from doing to directing — like a coach, not a player

If you’ve ever felt trapped in client work or wondered how to step back without losing control, this episode will change the way you think about your time — and your role. 

________________

PS: Whenever you’re ready… here are the fastest 4 ways we can help you fix and grow your accounting firm:

1. Download our famous Wize Freedom Strategy Map for FREE - Find out the 96 projects every firm owner must implement to build a $5M+ firm that can run without them - Download here

2. Need to Hire right now? Book a 1:1 FREE discovery call with our WizeTalent hiring coaches to help find your next team member the Wize Way – Click Here

3. Book a 1:1 Wize Discovery Session – Spend 30mins with our Wize CEO, Jamie Johns, a $7M firm owner who is ready to give you his entire business plan to build a firm that can run without you – Find out more here

4. Work with Jamie and our mentors for 8 weeks - Build a custom business plan for your firm - Apply here

SPEAKER_00:

Welcome to The Wise Way, the show for accounting and bookkeeping firm owners who want more time, profit, and freedom and a business that can run without them. I'm Brent Ward, your host, and each week we deep dive into the real stories, proven strategies, and battle-tested tools from successful firm owners just like you. Our wise mentors want to share their journey of how they've scaled and systemized their way to freedom so you can too. If you're stuck in the grind or you're ready to scale smarter, this is your blueprint. Let's get into the episode.

SPEAKER_01:

Hi everyone, I am here with Ed Chan. Um, glad to see him again. He just got back from his two-month amazing vacation that he gets to do because he owns his firm, but he basically got to bike around fantastic landscapes in Europe for two months with his wife, with the family, got to see friends. So he's coming back refreshed to talk to us about some of the burning topics that our members have been asking about. So yeah, very excited to dig in with you, Ed. How are you doing?

SPEAKER_02:

I'm well, thank you. Thank you. Thanks for having me, Chloe.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes, happy to hear that. Thank you. Um, so yeah, some of the questions that we've gathered, as always, come from uh, you know, careers that we have and ideas that our mentors and members have about certain topics. So I'm going to ask a few and see how you would tackle them. So one of the first things that we are are seeing in the current landscape and everything is that uh you've been um having your clients work with your senior client manager and everything is going so well that you get to take two months off to Europe to bike around Europe, you know. That happens and that's the best case scenario for you. But what do you do when this thing comes back and it fires back at you because your senior client manager, there could come a time when they're working with you and they might say, like, hey, um, well, why do you, as the owner of the business, no longer do chargeable work? And what's your role? Like, where do you fit in here if I am doing um the senior est activities here? It's a hard question situation. I would love to know how you how you have handled that because I'm sure with 50 plus um staff at uh Chan and Naylor, you've encountered this at some point.

SPEAKER_02:

Yes, surprisingly, I haven't. And and the reason for that, yeah, is that that's never been a problem. It's only because that um we we run a we run a deep and narrow team structure. Okay, and and most firms run a flat structure. So what I mean by that is that um they have the a an accountant do everything from interviewing the the client to doing the work, and then often the work's given back to the partner, and the partner goes and sees the client. Um, but we don't, and and if you run it like that, then of course, if the partner is no longer doing any work, then you're gonna get this question. Um but because we run it like a corporation, uh, where there's different positions in the team. So we run teams, and each person in the team has a different uh position on that on that team. So it's a bit like uh a sporting team. So if you and I I'll take a soccer team because I'm familiar with soccer in Australia, but in a soccer team, you've got different positions. You've got the fullback, you've got a goalie, you've got a winger, and and forwards and centers, and they all have a different role, and they all play in that role. And you know, they don't question the coach. The coach doesn't jump on the field to play the game with them. So they understand that the coach is not a player, he's he he he has to um you know work the whole team from from outside in and he's not part of the team, or it's like an orchestra where you've got everybody playing a different instrument and you've got the conductor out the front. The conductor doesn't jump in there and play an instrument uh with the with the orchestra, nor does the coach jump in there and and and and play a position. Because if he does jump in there and play the position, then he's not coaching, and you can't, it's very difficult to coach and to play. Uh as it is, you can't be a director, you can't direct an orchestra and play an instrument at the same time. And and often that's what accounting firms do. They do, they try, they mix it all up, and they, you know, they they do a bit of this and a bit of that, and it's all over the place. But we we don't do it, we have positions, if you like. And so we've got a senior client manager whose job is to just talk to clients, and they have to have a have to have a really good command of uh uh communication, and they've got to be a little bit more like a people person, they have to like to pick the phone up and talk. Whereas uh, you know, if you like to do the work, you tend to send an email, and uh often sending emails is not the best way to handle uh certain situations, especially if there's a complaint or there's a problem. It's much, much better to pick the phone up. But if you're someone that just does the work and you're not not a people person, you tend to send an email instead of picking the phone up and talking to the client. So you to hold a senior client manager uh role, you have to be very experienced. So you have to be able to communicate to the client and explain things to the client in the in language that they understand, not language that you understand. So you have to be able to be uh able to be able to communicate at at the client's level, uh, because anybody can communicate at our level, they are at our our level. We can talk accounting terms all day long, but you know, your the the clients don't understand you. And then we've we have a uh an assistant client manager who then takes care of all the C and D class clients at a low level, but they're they're they're getting trained up by the senior client manager on their interpersonal skills and the way they communicate and explain things to the client. And then we have a senior production manager who's very, very senior, but they're not a people person, they're not good at communication, they don't have to talk to clients. They sure they can send an email to the client saying, you know, there's a missing bank statement. Can you send that to me? So that level of communication is fine, and then and then and but they their job is to manage the team, they have to train the team, they have to check the work, they've got to um, you know, communicate with the senior client manager, um, tell them what's going on so that when the senior client manager goes and sees the client, you know, they're informed as to where the job is. Um, so this team uh that we run, we call it a deep and narrow team, made up of different personalities and different skill sets and in different positions. So play everybody's playing in position. So when you play in position, you're playing from a position of strength. So so you know, I I often hear uh uh owners say, oh, you know, I you know, I asked that accountant to ring the client and he sends an email, you know, and it's frustrating. Well, it's because the person, or or the other because you know, he just doesn't like picking the phone up and talking to the client. You know, it's because you know you you put a wrong person in a wrong seat and and then you're fighting that personality. And you can't you can't change your leopard spots. It's very difficult to change leopard spots, you can train them a little bit. And I and I found that you can train and train and train someone, and you can lift them, you know, you can lift them from here to here to be something that they're not. They can do that for a week and then they gradually go back to what they're naturally good at, and then you get all frustrated again. So it's no point in trying to change a leopard spot, so I often say. So you find the right person to fit that role. So often accountants will just go and hire, they're really, really busy and they're going, need another body to do the work, and they go out and they want to hire an accountant. Well, you know, if you if you did that, you're going to end up having a flat team structure. Um, but what we do is we we work out what the blueprint of this ideal team structure is first, so you know, those positions, and then we go and recruit the right person to fit that position, and it's a much better fit. So the staff stays there a lot longer. They're playing out in positions, so they're a lot happier. And if they're a lot happier, they're a lot more productive and and uh and they stay longer. And of course, the domino effect of that is huge. So so that's why I I don't get that question, uh Claudia, is because when we're recruiting, we're recruiting for the right position, and then when we're interviewing, we're we're looking for the position, we're looking for the person with the personality that fits that position. And then, you know, when they come on board, we explain they're in charge of this team, and this is their role, and uh, and they understand I'm I'm the conductor conducting and not someone that's playing the instrument. And uh so I I never get that question, but of course, most firms run it uh with like a flat, I call it a flat team structure. And then yes, you you will get someone if you're running it in a flat team structure, you will get someone wondering, what do you do? You know, yeah. Um so that's the reason, I guess. That's why I've never been asked that question.

unknown:

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01:

Um thank you so much, Ed, for your for pouring your thoughts into our conversation today. This was amazing. Um, as always, uh great pleasure having you, um, you know, sharing your wisdom and answering burning questions from who listens to us. And um, I would say to everyone to stay tuned. We're going to have even more content, even more wisdom on our episodes. So, yes, thank you so much, Ed.

SPEAKER_02:

No, thank you for having me and uh look forward to the next one.

SPEAKER_01:

Yes.

SPEAKER_00:

Thanks for tuning in to this episode of The Wise Way. If today's episode sparked an idea or helped you see things differently, please don't forget to leave us a review. And if you haven't subscribed to the podcast on your favourite platform yet, please go ahead and do that as well. Let's continue the conversation here through YouTube or any other social platforms that you can find us on. And just remember, if you're not a subscriber of our weekly Friday tip newsletter, you can get that to your inbox every week going forward. Whether you're starting out or scaling up, you don't have to do it alone. Let's build a business that works for you the wise way. We'll see you in the next episode.