The Wize Way

Episode 169: M&A 101: Must-Knows Before Buying a Firm

• Wize Mentoring for Accountants and Bookkeepers • Season 2 • Episode 169

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Thinking about acquiring another firm?

In this episode of The Wize Way Podcast, Jamie Johns unpacks the 10 critical things to look for in a potential acquisition  and the red flags that should make you walk away.

Joined by Tim and Kristy & Dani, Jamie shares:

✅ The four ways to grow your firm (and why M&A is the fastest one)
✅ The biggest mistakes first-time acquirers make
✅ Why cultural fit matters more than price
✅ How to structure a retention deal that protects your downside

If you’re looking to grow fast without the stress of scaling chaos, this episode is your M&A masterclass.

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PS: Whenever you’re ready… here are the fastest 4 ways we can help you fix and grow your accounting firm:

1. Download our famous Wize Freedom Strategy Map for FREE - Find out the 96 projects every firm owner must implement to build a $5M+ firm that can run without them - Download here

2. Need to Hire right now? Book a 1:1 FREE discovery call with our WizeTalent hiring coaches to help find your next team member the Wize Way – Click Here

3. Book a 1:1 Wize Discovery Session – Spend 30mins with our Wize CEO, Jamie Johns, a $7M firm owner who is ready to give you his entire business plan to build a firm that can run without you – Find out more here

4. Work with Jamie and our mentors for 8 weeks - Build a custom business plan for your firm - Apply here

Speaker 1:

Welcome to the Wise Way, the show for accounting and bookkeeping firm owners who want more time, profit and freedom, and a business that can run without them. I'm Bren Ward, your host, and each week, we deep dive into the real stories, proven strategies and battle-tested tools from successful firm owners. Just like you, our wise mentors want to share their journey of how they've scaled and systemized their way to freedom. So you can, too. If you're stuck in the grind or you're ready to scale smarter, this is your blueprint. Let's get into the episode.

Speaker 2:

We'd love to kick off, jamie, a lot of interest in today's topic. We're looking at, really, a 101 mergers and acquisitions masterclass. What are the top 10 things to look out for in a potential acquisition? So, jamie, just to set the context and set the scene, I'd love to hear a bit from you about, um, how, yeah, getting the secrets to m&a strategies has been really, um, foundational to the growth in your own firm over the last decade or so. Could you set the same scene for us before we dive into the details?

Speaker 3:

yeah, thanks, tim. Yeah, welcome everyone. Uh, it's a great topic today, um, particularly for those firms owners who are focused on growth and how they're going to get there. Um, so, look, if I wind back roughly about 10 years now, when I first met my mentor, ed chan, um, you know, ed said to me what sort of lifestyle do you want from your business? And so he was very much focused on beginning with the end in mind. You, you know why have you got this business? What are you doing it for? What's the end game? And I told you know, ed, that I went into business to have a better life and that at the time, I was probably working 100 hours a week and it really wasn't a better life. So there started the journey, tim, of where I guess I am today, and that was all about growing the business for a definitive end in mind, and that was to have more time, money and freedom.

Speaker 3:

Was that a one-year goal or a two-year goal? No, it wasn't. It was really a 10-year goal and a lifetime goal. So, to put it in context, I think everyone needs to sort of understand why they've got a business, and I don't think it's to work 100 hours a week for your entire life. Yeah, 100% yeah. So the other thing to recognise is really four ways to grow your firm. The first way is to grow with referrals. They were very much. I think I grew by referrals 20% in the early years. The second way to grow your firm is to get additional work from existing clients.

Speaker 3:

So, that's another way to grow. The third way to grow is advertising and marketing, and not many accountants do advertising and marketing because the government, in whatever country, just tends to drive work to your door. And the fourth way to grow is the topic today is to look at mergers or acquisitions and look, I think over the last 10 years I've probably done about 10 or 11 now, and in that 10-11 I've purchased bookkeeping fees, mortgage broking, financial planning, tax and accounting as well. So you know there's probably three or four different types of businesses there as well. And so you know, when I met Ed, my mentor, you know, ed said that M&As are one way to grow out of the four.

Speaker 3:

And you know before, I met Ed, I actually had done an acquisition but it was really a complete failure in the first couple of years. You know, I wish I had have known ed at the time because, um, you know, when my first acquisition, I did everything wrong. But then when I met ed, you know, like he, you know he'd maybe done 20 or 30 and, you know, all been involved in, uh, lots and lots of discussions and negotiations um helping other accounts with mergers and acquisitions as well. So, yeah, look to give you the context everyone you know at the moment there is really a lot of firms for sale. I think I subscribe, maybe to about you know, 10 different brokers around Australia. So there's, you know, it's just, I think the average age of the tax agent in Australia is about 54, 55. And I read a statistic the other day. I was on a webinar with Mortar Bean Carbon, one of those software companies, and I think 75% of CPAs were over 55 or 60 or something in the US. So there really is a lot of firms for sale.

Speaker 4:

And that's because of that baby boomer generation.

Speaker 3:

And let's not forget in Australia, for example, there's about $6 trillion worth of assets to pass to the next generation in the next 10 years.

Speaker 3:

So, the opportunity to buy a parcel of fees is definitely there, tim, but hence why we're here today. It's important that you avoid the horror stories. Yeah, you know I bought a parcel of fees and you know the owner ran off with them or it didn't work out and all that sort of thing. So, yeah, look, and probably the final thing to say, give everyone context. I think roughly in the first 10 years of my own firm it grew to roughly about a million dollars in fees. But the next 10 years because we're about 20 years old now Sky Accountants it grew by about $5 million, and part of that is organic growth, but part of that majority that's acquisitions as well.

Speaker 3:

And you know the banks will generally lend you 3.5 times the EBITDA of the consolidated EBITDA with the firm or the fees that you're purchasing. So for those who are out there looking to grow their firm, it is definitely a strategy that you can use and Ed Chanmore has used it and you know there's a lot of firms. I think a lot of firms do it, tim. The demand's very high. All the brokers I speak to, most of the firms, get sold.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's true. It's true. No, thanks for that introduction, jamie. It's been really inspiring just knowing you through some of that period of growth. I think you were, yeah, doing like maybe $3 million when I met you and you're doing a lot more than that now, jamie, you mentioned the opportunities which we should really be taking advantage of that. This is probably a time there's more accounting firms going for sale over the last five to ten years and in the future ten years than probably in previous decades, so it does seem like a good time to be looking at this topic. You mentioned the risks that come and that you've had bad experiences yourself. One of my heroes, warren Buffett, says risk comes from not knowing what you're doing. There's so much that you and Ed have bottled up, which is really in the Wise Hub. I was wondering if I can share screen or if you've got it. You can take us through what people might not know they already have access to, which is a bit of our WISE M&A mastery system. Does that sound good?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, that's fine. I think, Tim, it was about two or three years ago. We did a four-hour masterclass, which is actually on the screen there, tim, that Wise M&A playbook and workshop this one yeah, so obviously you've got to purchase that, but it's about four hours of absolute, like minute detailed content in the masterclass and there's also a mini course in there as well. So not not trying to sort of go on the sell to anyone, but you know, if you, to put it into perspective for everyone, if you're looking to buy, you know 250 000 in fees or 500 000 or a million, you really have to educate yourself if you've never done this before. I can't stress it enough.

Speaker 3:

If I had had the knowledge that I had now, like I would have paid a lot Because if you do an acquisition or a merge and you get it wrong, it will be costly, but if you get it right, it's, you know you can get a return on investment of. Ed says, and we know anywhere sort of maybe 40% up to 40% return on investment if you do a merger, that's simply because of the economies of scale. But my point here is, if you're looking at, you know, acquiring a parcel of Visa Furs another firm, just make sure that you get the knowledge that you need in order to do that, so that you know it doesn't go south, as we say, because it's that I think. What was it? Benjamin franklin said you know, um, an ounce of is better than a pound of, um, yeah, and I've seen on some of the you know the community, in the chats where you know people have said, you know, they've got an anonymous post and they said, oh look, you know I bought a parcel of fees.

Speaker 3:

It hasn't worked, worked out, and you know people just get so emotional and you know sleepless nights, they've lost money. They might have borrowed Tim, they might have borrowed money to buy the fees and then they've lost the clients. So you know, we've all heard of the horror stories. So that four-hour workshop that Ed and I and Wise put together. You know, in comparison to the investment in yourself versus, you know you're buying $500,000 of fees, it's like minute, so, yeah, so we call that the Wise M&A Playbook, but certainly in our software as well, the Wise Hub, we have a lot of tools that you need to navigate as well. And, as you said earlier, tim, it's about minimising the risk. It's all about minimising the risk. Yeah, that's exactly right.

Speaker 2:

So that's probably maybe a good place to start, Jamie, because that's like one of the core issues here.

Speaker 3:

Oh, there's a few questions.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, I think one of the things that I asked Ed when he was mentoring me like yourself, I was really blessed to be mentored by Ed and one question a lot of firms I work with ask is you know, is this important? Is this important, is this necessary? And as we can see here, jamie, you've got, I think, about 10 or so different questions there Just to pick your brains on it. Is any single one of these, you know, non-negotiable or a deal breaker? How do you go about that negotiating process and figuring out what's important and what isn't as important?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, not, anyone is. Tim, it's really on what they would say a majority of factors. I sound like a lawyer On the majority of factors. You've got to work out whether it's a good deal and you've really got that 12 checklist there, and one of the most important ones would be the retention. Um, so really, the more red you see, the more risk in this particular uh matrix. But, uh, you know. So everyone you want to educate yourself about what a retention is.

Speaker 3:

If you don't know what a retention is, you, you really need to get up to speed with the retention. But you know, often when you buy all the parcel of fees, you might, for example, pay, you know, 70% at settlement and then 15% in year one and 15% in year two. So that's really a two-year retention. You know, a lot of the times you see vendors who are selling they might do say they might want a one-year retention. So you know they might want a one-year retention. So, um, you know you might. They might want 80 up front and then 20 in 12 months time if the actual fees come in that you've purchased now with the retention. This would be the one of the 10 points, tim, but you know it's probably the most important thing to structure correctly to reduce your risk. Because if I've got a really, really good retention, it just means at the end of the day I'm only going to pay for the clients that stay. And so you know, in the spirit of Warren Buffett, if your risk is low, I'm actually quite happy to pay a bit more for the business. You know, low risk, happy to pay. Maybe you know more than potentially what the vendor's even asking. But if the risk is high and someone says, oh no, look, I don't want any retention, I just want 100% paid up front, I'm not going to pay much for that. So it's that dictonomy of risk and return and one of the things there on the checklist you know we've got, the retention period is more than is two years or more, um, so you know. So I've done deals where the retention has been one year. Uh, the risk has been, uh, relatively low. I've done deals where the retention has been two years, um.

Speaker 3:

And then also the next question there you know what is the retention amount, you know. So you know under the under the deal amount, you know. So you know, under the deal, do you pay 90% up front? Or you know, as I said earlier, do you pay 60% up front? You know. So there's all those sort of those 12-point questions there. Just, you know, even in today's workshop, if you could get your mind around those 12 points and you know, really understand that in more new detail, you're, you know, you're well in the way to educating yourself. What looks like a good deal versus what looks like a bad deal when it comes to acquiring, you know, a parcel of fees or acquiring another firm, yeah, love it.

Speaker 2:

I remember once and there's a, like you said just before, jamie, there's a bit of like, a kind of like a zero sum game between terms and and um price. It taught me, like, if the price is really yeah, does that make sense? If the price is really good, the terms might not be as good, but vice versa, if the terms are really good and it's less risky, you'll be willing to pay a higher price potentially tim, perhaps if I just share my screen for everyone here today, yeah, please.

Speaker 3:

Please Can you see that Wise M&A deal matrix there, Tim yeah.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3:

Does that come up?

Speaker 2:

Yeah, the big rocks, pebbles and sand.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, yeah. So just to share this with everyone, this is one of the screens out of our Wise M&A playbook that I mentioned earlier. But you know Ed Chen taught me this and you mentioned earlier, uh, but you know ed chan taught me this and um, you know ed said when you're doing a deal, you want to look at the big rocks the pebbles and the sand right and I had a chuckle to myself and ed said well, it's a bit like a bucket.

Speaker 3:

He said you know, what you do is, um, you put the big rocks in first and then you put the pebbles in and then you put the sand in and said that makes a really solid deal.

Speaker 3:

And I ed was analogy, um, but look, everyone, in terms of the big rocks, um, you've got there the price, the, the terms of retention, the finance, the vetting of the vendor, of the employees, the location, um, use your risk pay tool that tim just had up earlier and your letter off it now with the big rocks. It's important that you focus on those first, because if you, if you really get down into the detail too quickly and you miss the big rocks, you could waste hours and hours of time. So it's important that, as you're negotiating and you're putting the deal together, um, and whether it's with a broker or not, that you really look at this sort of Y is M and A matrix, because you know you want to agree on the price. Okay, you want to agree on the price, you want to agree on the terms of retention. And what about at finance? You know, is it subject to finance as well? So you know, and the vetting of the vendor and the employees, that's all about cultural fit. I would never do a deal if the cultural fit wasn't there.

Speaker 3:

It's very important that when you ask for information, if you're a buyer, that you get the information quickly. You know always red flags in every single touch, moment or interaction with a vendor or the person who's selling tells you about how you know their place to sell their business or sell their practice. So if you have to wait for days on ending information, if they don't respond to emails, don't return phone calls, you know it's just red, for it's just really red flags. So there's a lot of things to go through, you know. One of the classic ones is if the vendor wants to sell a business, you know if they've got staff that have been there 10, 15, 20 years, well, have they asked them?

Speaker 3:

You know that's one that you know has helped me avoid a couple of disasters. You know they didn't even ask their own staff, who had been there 10, 15 years, whether they wanted some equity in the business. So that's just. You know. It's not about the buyer, it's about the seller being ready and prepared. You know locations one, and so you're moving to the pebbles then. So you've got the heads of agreement, you've got to do due diligence, do your due diligence around the staff. And then there's also letters. There should be a series of letters that go out before settlement and then after settlement, how are you going to tackle the brandy? That's important as well. So then you know some more investigated into the vendor and change management. You know. So change management is very, very important and one of the best things you can do there. When I move over to the sand, now on the screen you've got their merge meetings. So you know, one of the most important meetings you have is your post-merge meetings, and they can go on for six months after you do the acquisition as well.

Speaker 3:

So the other thing I'd say there, with all due respect to lawyers, you know, be careful with lawyers. Sometimes they can be over-vigilant, vigilant. They can be sort of quite not entrepreneurial. They're very, very technical people. We need lawyers and all due respect to them that you want the deal to happen. You don't want a lawyer to come in and just nitpick like every single paragraph and every line of the contract, because that'll just stifle the deal and I've seen that happen as well. So the contract itself meeting the staff is important, tim, you know, making sure that they know what's going on, but the timing is critical. Timing is critical and then obviously, your client handover process as well. So that's what we call the Wise M&A Deal Matrix and it's just to give people a guide on what you should be discussing and when you should be discussing it, so that you know you put a, you put a nice acquisition or a merge together in that way. So I just thought I'd share that screen there to you.

Speaker 2:

No, it's so helpful. Thank you for sharing that, jamie, because I think I know my own experience and with some of the firms I've worked with. They don't split it into big rocks, pebbles and sand and, as a result, they get really worked up about all the minute detail and that can risk sinking the deal. So it's really helpful just to know what really matters.

Speaker 3:

It's like trying to get into the detail of the contract, but you haven't agreed on the price.

Speaker 2:

Exactly, exactly. Yeah, yeah, you waste legal fees, you waste time waste money, yeah, and a couple of things.

Speaker 3:

You waste time waste money.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, um, and a couple of things you've said to me. Um, again, if anyone's got questions, please, please. Now is a great time to ask, jamie, but a couple of things you've said to me over the last year or two have been so helpful that, yeah, the vendor, the vendor's integrity has to fit. You can't do a good deal with a bad person is one of buffett's, I think, sayings. And, and I think you said to me, like fairly recently, jamie, it shouldn't be feel forced, it should feel kind of natural. That doesn't mean it's not a negotiation, but that was really helpful. And you said to me, maybe nine out of 10 acquisitions that you look at, you don't end up doing, you know, and let someone else jump on the hand grenade if it just seems too risky. Those little Jamie-isms.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, that's right. Look, a great deal over the 10 or so I've done is where they just naturally flowed him and I'm talking about the cultural fit. So you know people are responsive, the information is forthcoming very clear. Yeah, the communication is almost over-communicate, not under-communicate, yeah. So yeah, the cultural fit is very, very important. It doesn't matter how good the deal is, but if you can't get along with the vendor, it's a bad sign hey.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, we can't get along with the key people within the business. Then you know it's red flags. You're better to avoid it. Yeah, that's right. No.

Speaker 2:

I love that.

Speaker 4:

Yeah.

Speaker 2:

We've got some people are sharing some love for the course M&A course Really happy to hear it's been useful. I can't stress enough. Just the IP in that course is just so good and it's all from live experience, isn't it, jamie? From you and from Ed, over decades of doing exhibitions.

Speaker 3:

It's all Ed's career and all my career and all my experience uh, just really laser focused into you know what makes a good m&a and what doesn't. But you know, I think, I think from a uh, a big picture point of view, um, if you're here and you're you're on your own firm, you really should start. You know what is the lifestyle, what. What do you want on your own firm you really should start at. You know what is the lifestyle, what do you want from your business? Secondly, how much income do you want to make from the business to fund that lifestyle? And then, on your business plan, or what we call it, why is your growth plan? You know, do acquisitions fit into that? And if they fit into that, when?

Speaker 3:

So I'm always about goals, goals being smart, goals, tim, and everyone like so yeah, be time bound. So you know, a dream remains a dream without a date. They say, you know, yeah, so yeah, but but on that journey, it's very important, everyone, that you get your house in order. You know, if you're absolutely, you know, flat out now and swamped with compliance, work or whatever you're doing, then you know, maybe it's just not the time for you. I must admit all the acquisitions. That I did right. I had my team set up. You know, I had my senior client managers in place, so I had my Fab Five. I knew exactly what the teams and the firm were doing from a key performance indicator point of view. Um. So you know, part of that m&a playbook team that we talk about is in the in the earlier chapters is get your house in order.

Speaker 3:

You know one of the things that ed taught me was. He said jamie, if you scale your firm and I'd already done it right from my mistakes, you know if you if you've got a firm that's got problems.

Speaker 3:

Now you know, and then you scale the firm or buy an acquisition. You're only going to scale problems Right. So it is important that you know you get your org chart sorted out, that you know you've got time yourself, because obviously, tim, this is going to take time to do these acquisitions, but you know, so you've got to get your. My message there is get your foundations right, make sure you've got you know your capacity plan right.

Speaker 3:

Make sure you've got enough capacity, Make sure that you know, if you're a workaholic now and you haven't got time now, I'd probably avoid the acquisition part until you're ready, you know, at some point, until you've just got those foundations right, that would be it could be a question.

Speaker 4:

You know when do I do an acquisition, Jamie, you know so not when you work 100 hours a week. Yeah, yeah, yeah Not yet Totally.

Speaker 2:

I love that we might just finish up with one question from Shaleen and then we'll hop into the breakout. Thanks so much for that. Jamie Shaleen, you're asking which is a really interesting question. Actually, I'd love to hear your take on it For a merger where the vendor would like to stay on in a much reduced capacity. Like what would a good structure look like there? Have you seen that before?

Speaker 3:

Oh yeah, many times I've even done it myself. Fantastic everyone. For, oh yeah, many times even done it myself. Uh, fantastic everyone. If, uh, if the vendor's willing to stay on one or two or three or five years and then have a slow, have a slow exit um you know the guys I've worked with.

Speaker 3:

You know they're the first one or two years they've stayed on full time. They've then handed over the clients, they've handed over the relationship to the senior client manager, um, and then, and then what's happened, tim, is they've slowly reduced. They've handed over the relationship to the senior client manager, um, and then, and then what's happened, tim, is they've slowly reduced. They've gone to like three days a week. You know, yeah, so then after another six months you're going to two days a week and then you know they've slowly retired. So you know, yeah, we've got to remember everyone that often the vendor selling, you know, as they say this is their baby, you know, like they they started sperm 10, 20, 30 years ago, um, in some cases, and you know they, it's very emotional, uh, for them. Yeah, you're likely to sell your business or your practice once in your lifetime. So, yeah, if someone's willing to stay on for for two or three or years and then sort of slowly exit, you know that's fantastic. I think that's honourable, I think that's a good thing and everyone can work together.

Speaker 3:

The thing is in the planning. Everyone Plan, plan, plan. Most people don't plan. What's that all saying? Those who fail to plan, plan Sorry.

Speaker 4:

those who fail to plan plan. Yeah. Fail to plan plan to fail, yeah, yeah. Fail to plan Plan to fail, yeah.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, so you know, the key things that I do is consolidate a cash flow forecast, consolidate a bidder. I work out all the teams in the capacity plan as well, Tim, who's going to do what you know? The other question is what are you going to change and what aren't you going to change?

Speaker 1:

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 3:

I can see some participants here today where I've spoken or I've said don't change anything. You know, don't change anything as soon as you change the colour of the chair or you change your phone system or something. You know. People see human beings. We don't like change, but when trust is high, change is fast there's like Dr Stephen Cubby's son. He wrote the book called the Speed of Trust.

Speaker 3:

And in the book called the Speed of Trust. Everyone can get it. He actually quotes Warren Buffett. Warren Buffett did like a multi-million dollar deal and did it in 48 hours because he had so much trust in the vendor.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, totally.

Speaker 3:

The point is, when trust is high, when you've won people's confidence, you can then change things, and, from my experience over the last 20 years, everyone trust has to be built and normally a merger and acquisition takes about two years to settle in. Roughly two years to settle in, and Ed Chan would tell you the same thing.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, huge, so helpful, so much wisdom there. Thanks so much for sharing that with us, jamie. Hope everyone got plenty out of it. You can see here on my screen the stuff we're talking about today. So step 14 is in the Wise Vault and there's some videos with Ed and Jamie on M&As. And then, yeah, hop in your Wise Hub, go to board and execute to look at all the IP we were showing you today, and I think if you've done all that and you still want to see more, you can hop into. I think it's like a four-hour master system that we did, and there's a huge e-book there too, isn't there?

Speaker 3:

There's also a mini course in there too for those who are interested in the step-by-step.

Speaker 3:

But the other thing thing everyone, if you don't have it, make sure you reach out to, to sammy here or our wise team. You should get a copy of our wise freedom strategy map. So we recently released it. It's about a hundred steps to do exactly what I've done and the other mentors and and the firms that we'll work with, but it's called the wise freedom strategy map. Please reach out to us, get a copy of it, because in Stage 3, the sort of more advanced stage, is where we talk about, you know, buying a parcel of fees as well.

Speaker 3:

So yeah, it's called the Wise Freedom Strategy Map and it's really 100 steps to you know, it's just a blueprint of what you need to do to achieve your goals with your firm and your lifestyle.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, yeah, totally, I'm looking at it right now. That's why I'm looking after this idea. I've got it on my office wall Huge, huge map. So, yeah, that's totally recommend that. Okay, so what we'll do now is we'll hop into the breakout rooms. Thanks again so much, jamie, for that.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, whirlwind tour of an M&A. So we'll have two breakouts. We'll have one with Jamie and Christy, that'll be breakout room one, and then I'll head up the other one and then we'll see you all back at five minutes to the hour. Thanks, thanks again. Uh, well, thanks thanks so much for um for for joining us today. Just a couple of things um, be a tragedy if you walked away from here and you weren't aware that we could help you in some way. So, just, um, got on the slide there. Hopefully everyone can see that, okay, uh, if you're relatively new here and you're not aware of what we offer. Um, like I said, we've been lucky to have danny heading up wise talent on the call with us today and everyone in my own breakout room. We really touched on, jamie, how hard it is to find good staff and how doing a tuck-in can actually help you get good staff, not just more fees. So, yeah, if you are looking at hiring overseas or in your own country of operation, please reach out to Dani and she will be more than happy to meet with you to see how we can help.

Speaker 2:

We mentioned the Wise Hub today as well. I'm sure if you're on this call you probably already have your subscription, but a lot of the IP we looked at today is in the Wise Hub. So much information there. You also get a wise vault subscription. So if, for some reason, you're not um signed up for that again, reach, reach out to us and jamie can take you through uh, all of that um. If you're looking to grow, like we said today, there's the m a system. There's also training um, which can help you vetting new hires, and there's also our flagship mentoring coaching program, wise Growth, which I head up with the other mentors as well. And we've got a brand new one, wise Elite. Jamie, do you want to just I don't think it's on the slide there do you want to take people through Wise Elite just quickly and tell them what's involved in that one?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, thanks, tim. Now Wise Elite is a new initiative. We started a few months ago and it's going really well, and essentially what happens is everyone every Wednesday, you have a call with myself and basically what you do is the firms in there are following what we call the Wise Freedom Strategy Map, so that is a step-by-step blueprint of how to achieve your goals in turn, whether that's growth or building a team, whatever it may be, we follow the wise freedom strategy map, which you get a copy of you won't have a copy of it now and then every Wednesday, the firms come together with myself and I follow one of those steps on the Wise Freedom Strategy map. That's about the first 15 minutes, and sometimes firms are really infatuated with that particular topic, but the rest of the time is the firms that are in Wise Elite Coaching ask me every single question they've ever had or ever got, and the rhythm and routine on that is every week, and that way it gives you an opportunity to connect with me once a week and ask me a question.

Speaker 3:

This is my problem, jamie. I'm looking to do this, but this is what's blocking me. This is my barrier. How do I overcome that? How do I approach this particular topic with a client, or how do I approach this situation with a staff member, or you know it could be any question. Guys that you've got. You know when do I need to hire, when do I do not need to hire? Why aren't I making enough money? You know why am I so busy? You know why am I going crazy, why am I a workaholic? So why is elite coaching is every week?

Speaker 3:

Um, it is group coaching, but I can tell you what, if you ask a question, I can beat my bottom dollar. Um, that all the other firms need to know the same thing. And so we've got firms in there that are very small. Uh, you know, some will be 100, 000, 200, 000 fees. Uh, right up to some firms that are turning over $8 million, and everyone's on the same journey. They're on the same path. So, you know, I welcome you to look at that with me, happy to do a one-on-one with you and you can do a deep dive, just so you get that little bit more help and guidance from a coach or a mentor.

Speaker 3:

All successful people, doesn't matter what field you look at sport, they have a coach or a mentor. All successful people, doesn't matter what field you look at sport, they have a coach or a mentor, and I just think you've got to find the right person, someone who's done it. You know someone who's done it, someone who's living it, and that's important to that aspect as well. So, if you want to have a call book, a call with me to investigate that further. And it's quite affordable too. It's not, you know, perhaps what you're thinking thousands and thousands of dollars. It's quite affordable for firms who are looking to have a coach or mentor or someone to help them on a weekly basis.

Speaker 4:

It's also great from a accountability perspective, isn't it, Jamie, that there are daily and weekly non-negotiables, and it's about helping you create the habits in the micro to have the macro result?

Speaker 3:

oh, absolutely. You know it's definition of insanity everyone is doing the same thing every day.

Speaker 3:

You expect it to be a result now you know, if you're here, I can probably imagine you want some change, you want something better for your life or your business. So does that mean that you're gonna have to change? Of course it does. It does so, you know, without being rude. You know it helps you that, with accountability, to change your thinking, to change the way. If you change your thinking, you can change your decisions, to change your actions. That's where you'll change your circumstances. That's what it is yeah, yeah so good, so good, chris, chris.

Speaker 2:

Chris is representing Wise Elite there. It's gold Three months in starting to see things happen. That's why we're here, chris. We love to hear it.

Speaker 3:

I'll salute you that 50 later on. Chris, yeah Thanks. Chris, yeah thanks.

Speaker 2:

And thanks everyone so much for joining us. Our next topic really is quite pertinent. We talked a lot about trying to find good people and how people are constrained, which might hold you back from doing a tuck in in my breakout. Well, our next one is on how to retain your best employees. It's not simply enough to find them, is it? These days you've got to retain them. So how to build a great culture in your firm never been more challenging, with working from home and distributed teams, so really, really great. Topic 8 am on Eastern Coast well, not Eastern Coast New Zealand, new South Wales and Victoria, isn't it?

Speaker 3:

This is a massive topic, tim, that over the next few years. You know there's supply and demand in our industry. It's getting more difficult to find people, so you're going to have to learn skills and tools to retain your people.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, way more important people. So you're going to have to learn skills and tools to retain your people.

Speaker 4:

yeah, yeah yeah, we're also going further into that topic in the wise talent monthly call as well. Danny, what date is your clinic? Uh, ours should be the 4th of november, which I think is melbourne cup day it is melbourne cup Day for you Victorians National holiday.

Speaker 2:

Apparently it's state holiday, isn't it? Wild, wild? We're all working up in New South Wales, but yeah, so plenty of are they recorded? Dani as well, if people can't make it?

Speaker 4:

Yeah, and they'll be in the Wise Vault.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, too good, too good. So two for the price of one next month on retention. All Two good, two good. So two for the price of one next month on retention. All right, thanks so much for joining us everyone, and thank you, jamie.

Speaker 3:

That's right. Hope everyone got something to take away from today at least. Yeah, totally.

Speaker 4:

Bye everyone, Great to see you.

Speaker 2:

Catch up. Thank you so much, bye-bye, bye-bye.

Speaker 1:

Thanks for tuning in to this episode of the Wise Way. If today, bye-bye any other social platforms that you can find us on, and just remember, if you're not a subscriber, our weekly Friday tip newsletter you can get that to your inbox every week going forward. Whether you're starting out or scaling up, you don't have to do it alone. Let's build a business that works for you. The wise way. We'll see you in the next episode.